Help me salvage my trip please

[parks71]

For months I have a trip planned to drive 5 hours to camp for 5 days and ride the FATS trails and now I see it is closed??? Then it says wear orange from oct 1st till jan, so does this mean I can ride it, just wear orange?

If not, are there other trails in the area besides bartram that I can ride or should I just find a different place to go? This really sucks, my buddy is supposed to leave in the morning for a week there and I am leaving thursday. Any help would be great.

[Angela]

You should be fine and have a great time - we have about 150 miles of trail in here and this will give you a great opportunity to try some of the other ones that are great trails. The only thing you will miss during your trip will be the new section of the Bartram Lake Trail that heads west out of the Petersburg trailhead and will be closed for hunting until November 1st.

We have lots of great singletrack trails while you wait for FATS to reopen on Sunday the 24th - Most should be in excellent condition since we had a recent event that covered Horn Creek (6 miles), Turkey and Wine Creek (in out trail 25 total) and Modoc (in out trail 12 total). Those trails are closely grouped and all are great rides! Lots of riders love Keg Creek and Mistletoe as well again very close to where you are staying.

You might discover this is a blessing in disguise, a lot of people come to the area, get on FATS and just spend the whole time riding that 32 miles of trail. You'll get to ride some of the others and then finish with FATS sounds like a perfect trip to me!

[neal1975]

Doesnt it just suck?

Its the perfect time of year to ride, the weather is perfect, cool and crisp in the evening - you wait all year long, you grind your way through the 95 deg. summer ...............modification of post by moderator

[seenvic]

Oct 19, 2010 17:34:38 GMT -5 neal1975 said:

Doesnt it just suck?

Its the perfect time of year to ride, the weather is perfect, cool and crisp in the evening - you wait all year long, you grind your way through the 95 deg. summer - modification of post by moderator

For Parks 71...yes. He had something planned and this caught him by surprise and for that I feel bad for him. We try to get the word out, but there is no way we are going to reach everyone.

For locals....come on man. There are plenty of other trails to ride.

This annual closure was part of the process of getting the trails approved. Before the trails were built, a public notice was sent out to all interested parties. All the responses were positive except for one from SCDNR was negative. In order to mitigate this negative impact on hunting, the two week closure was agreed to before the first inch of dirt was moved.

[dgaddis1]

+1

Lots of other trails to ride. Bsides, all of the other trails are just now coming into their prime. Fewer spider webs, less overgrowth, now is the time to ride all the old school trails. FATS is mostly a summer trail for me.

[brianW]

Oct 19, 2010 17:34:38 GMT -5 neal1975 said:

Doesnt it just suck?

Its the perfect time of year to ride, the weather is perfect, cool and crisp in the evening - you wait all year long, you grind your way through the 95 deg. summer - modification of post by moderator

Have to disagree with this. Hunters have every right to enjoy the outdoors just like hikers, people that fish, bird watchers and us mt bikers.

We have 50 weeks a year to ride (or hike or trail run) at FATS a few of those weeks we share the woods with hunters who only have from roughly 16 weeks. Also as mentioned there are numerous other locations in the CSRA that have awesome trails that are just as fun if mot (in my opinion) more fun than FATS.

[neal1975]

MOD - if you had to censor my post because of a criticism, and one that was made in jest, then thats pretty weak.

Is this forum too sensitive to hear the criticism of a member? Personally i think its absurd that they have to close down 40 miles of biking trails so a bunch of redneck idiots can sit motionless in tree stands and shoot deer. Theres thousands of acres of hunting land in GA and SC, why do they have to close down the biking trails for that? Are the trails closed to hunters when the bikers are on them?

Does anyone else find it a little dissapointing that the one spot within a 100 mile radius that is the centerpiece for the mountain biking has to close down for 2 weeks to appease the hunting crowd - F THAT! (mod you dont have to censor it, i did it for you)

[Angela]

Perhaps you didn't get the personal message I sent you about why I modified your post. Had absolutely nothing to do with your criticism and if you frequently read the posts on this forum you will find that there is plenty of criticism, sarcasm and all kinds of things to go around and stand as posted.

I modified your post because because of language and am happy to see that you censored yourself on this post. This is a forum read by the public and in that group children so posters need to be mindful of that.

You certainly have the right to your opinion of course but just a few points while you are making your opinion heard. Number one this is a multi-use trail not a biking trail. It was built for hikers, bikers, runners, and any other trail users (including hunters) to go to enjoy the woods - they probably would rather we not be in the woods but I'm sure for some the trails provide a convenient route to their favorite hunting spot.

As Seenvic elaborated on elsewhere - since this plot of land had been used for hunting for probably hundreds of years before the first inch of trail was put in I'm certain once they discovered a trail was being built through the woods many were not happy. Fortunately most hunters are law-abiding citizens and have shared the woods with us without incident. The one concession to this is the short closure at the start of hunting season as he said we knew that going in.

Again you have your opinion that thankfully most reading this forum don't share - to refer to hunters collectively as redneck idiots is quite simply boorish behavior in my opinion, some of the mountain bikers you pass on the trail are hunters, hunters permeate every area of society and up and down the socio-economic ladder.

People are always going to find it disappointing when what they are trying to do is thwarted by anything but most people can be good sports about it. With 150 miles of trail in the area and only about a third of it closed momentarily it simply isn't an issue most folks just plan accordingly and move on.

[seenvic]

Oct 20, 2010 0:21:42 GMT -5 neal1975 said:

MOD - if you had to censor my post because of a criticism, and one that was made in jest, then thats pretty weak.

Is this forum too sensitive to hear the criticism of a member? Personally i think its absurd that they have to close down 40 miles of biking trails so a bunch of redneck idiots can sit motionless in tree stands and shoot deer. Theres thousands of acres of hunting land in GA and SC, why do they have to close down the biking trails for that? Are the trails closed to hunters when the bikers are on them?

Does anyone else find it a little dissapointing that the one spot within a 100 mile radius that is the centerpiece for the mountain biking has to close down for 2 weeks to appease the hunting crowd - F THAT! (mod you dont have to censor it, i did it for you)

Yes, the entire forest is closed to deer hunting about 8 months a year. Not just the tiny section that makes up FATS, but the entire forest. Private property too - no deer hunting for 8 months of the year.

I don't share your disappointment.

Here is the deal. Alot of people poured alot of time, money and work into building FATS and I can say with almost complete confidence that "we" don't share your disappointment. I have no problem with the deer season closure and I have worked countless hours at FATS, attended meetings for 10 years to gain the approval, started SORBA CSRA to get organized.

I am going to leave it the folks who did nothing and still do nothing but ride/run at FATS to complain. Have at it. Every group has their do nothing whiners.

For me FATS is nice place to ride a bike and at one time was the centerpiece of my mountain biking. But when I realized what had happened to my skills from riding FATS too much, it is no longer the centerpiece to my riding. FATS is a nice place to ride a bike on trails in the woods while losing any sense of "mountain bike" skill one may have had. And if you have no skills, FATS will prevent you from gaining any skills as it doesn't require any skill to ride there. I say all this as one of the designers of FATS. I have lived and learned.

All that said, I am proud FATS has brought so many into the woods on a bike. I just hope one day some of them become mountain bikers with some skills and can enjoy the sport on more than flow trails.

[willied]

Oct 20, 2010 7:47:42 GMT -5 seenvic said:

For me FATS is nice place to ride a bike and at one time was the centerpiece of my mountain biking. But when I realized what had happened to my skills from riding FATS too much, it is no longer the centerpiece to my riding. FATS is a nice place to ride a bike on trails in the woods while losing any sense of "mountain bike" skill one may have had. And if you have no skills, FATS will prevent you from gaining any skills as it doesn't require any skill to ride there. I say all this as one of the designers of FATS. I have lived and learned.

You can make it hard it you fly through it. You can get some good air and what not. ;D

At least with this closure the trail gets some time to rest.

[justjoe]

Someone please help me understand. I can ride Wine, Turkey, Modoc, Keg Creek and the dam end of Bartram all of which are on Gov. land and are open to hunters but I only have to worry about getting shot on FATS or the Wildwood side of Bartram.?

[wooglin]

You have to worry about getting shot at all those places. But chances are better at FATS and that part of Bartram because you're not expected to be there.

Edit: WTF is the issue here? Some trails got built on the condition we not ride them at certain times of the year. Its not like this is rocket science. Its called a compromise.

[seenvic]

Oct 20, 2010 20:10:20 GMT -5 wooglin said:

Edit: WTF is the issue here? Some trails got built on the condition we not ride them at certain times of the year. Its not like this is rocket science. Its called a compromise.

Ding ding, we have a winner.

[neal1975]

I dont think its the two weeks closure that bothers me - its that you have potentially very dangerous / fatal consequences lurking in the woods while you are just trying to enjoy a bike ride. I rode recently and heard 4-5 gun shots not far off. It bothered me. These two hobbies shouldnt co-exist in the same space. I have a negative opinion of hunters because - you take the gun out of their hands, and 9 times out of 10 their just a dumb hick in a pickup truck with nothing else to add to the world - nothing to add or give back to nature, theyre just there to shoot something, for sport. Im out there to enjoy and feel closer to nature and try to appreciate it, and some ahole is out there hiding in a tree with my head in his crosshairs - so yeh, i dont like that.

Personally i think the tiny parcel of land that encompasses the fats trails should be . . . wait for it. . . just for bike riding. And the hunting can be anywhere else in the 100,000 nearby acres where people arent trying to ride in peace and safety.

[wooglin]

Oct 20, 2010 21:31:03 GMT -5 neal1975 said:

These two hobbies shouldnt co-exist in the same space.

At FATS, for the first two weeks of rifle season, they don't. Its win-win for you!

Oct 20, 2010 21:31:03 GMT -5 neal1975 said:

its that you have potentially very dangerous / fatal consequences lurking in the woods while you are just trying to enjoy a bike ride.

PS-- You're not a roadie, are you?

[neal1975]

riding on the road is an entirely different subject, dont get me started.

its a lot more dangerous than people realize. one of the doctors at the hospital i work at was riding recently and was hit by a car really bad.

he is still in a coma.

[ted]

THREADJACK

[oddcouple]

Oct 20, 2010 21:31:03 GMT -5 neal1975 said:

I rode recently and heard 4-5 gun shots not far off. It bothered me.

If you heard the shots you are fine if you don't hear them you are probably dead.

Oct 20, 2010 21:31:03 GMT -5 neal1975 said:

I have a negative opinion of hunters because - you take the gun out of their hands, and 9 times out of 10 their just a dumb hick in a pickup truck with nothing else to add to the world - nothing to add or give back to nature, they're just there to shoot something, for sport. I'm out there to enjoy and feel closer to nature and try to appreciate it, and some ahole is out there hiding in a tree with my head in his crosshairs - so yeh, i dont like that.

Please I beg you to stop showing your ignorance.

[wooglin]

Thank you Ted. If you're going to send me PMs you need to take me off your blocked list.

Neal, though I spend a lot of time on the trail, I'm a roadie and have been for 35 years. I'm pretty sure I have a very, very clear understanding of the dangers. Your position, that we can't or shouldn't share (whether it be the road or trail), is unrealistic and won't get us anywhere but relegated to sidewalks and paved rail-trails. And those are no fun. You really ought to rethink it. Life is full of compromises.

[dgaddis1]

Oct 20, 2010 21:31:03 GMT -5 neal1975 said:

I dont think its the two weeks closure that bothers me - its that you have potentially very dangerous / fatal consequences lurking in the woods while you are just trying to enjoy a bike ride. I rode recently and heard 4-5 gun shots not far off. It bothered me. These two hobbies shouldnt co-exist in the same space.

If you feel that way, then just don't ride where people are allowed to hunt during hunting season. That's pretty simple.