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Post by oddcouple on Jul 12, 2009 21:58:50 GMT -5
I rode FATS this afternoon I had know idea you supposed to ride around the rocks, pallets,and roots.Man makes me feel dumb to just find this out.I have been riding wrong all this time.
Russell Hale
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Post by Mark Y on Jul 12, 2009 23:09:40 GMT -5
Hey man, didn't you know them are "obstacles" to avoid!  |
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Post by seenvic on Jul 13, 2009 8:19:07 GMT -5
I went out and got me 4 inches of front and rear travel so I can ride around those pesky obstacles.
I wonder why anyone would carry those heavy bricks out there just so folks can have something to ride around.
I'm just glad the boy scouts built these trails for us to ride.
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Post by ted on Jul 13, 2009 8:19:26 GMT -5
I rode FATS this afternoon I had know idea you supposed to ride around the rocks, pallets,and roots.Man makes me feel dumb to just find this out.I have been riding wrong all this time. Russell Hale I guess I'm stoopid too. I didn't know you could build trails out of shipping pallets. I must have overlooked that section in the "Trail Solutions" manual. Maybe there should be more put out before the IMBA Summit? I noticed a large stack in the parking lot. |
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Post by seenvic on Jul 13, 2009 8:59:39 GMT -5
I guess I'm stoopid too. I didn't know you could build trails out of shipping pallets. I must have overlooked that section in the "Trail Solutions" manual. Maybe there should be more put out before the IMBA Summit? I noticed a large stack in the parking lot. So lets tell the folks who do the work they are doing it wrong. And lets start by telling them something they already know. Brilliant! |
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Post by Angela on Jul 13, 2009 11:32:39 GMT -5
Reminding folks and educating folks in a positive, constructive way is the only thing that will stop most of them from widening the trails by riding around "obstacles". Setting a good example by not riding around those "obstacles" ourselves is imperative and not always practiced. There are folks out there who just don't care and there isn't any amount of reminding, educating or berating that is going to change that but if we can productively and constructively get the word out to all the others, it will have a positive impact. |
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Post by ted on Jul 13, 2009 11:40:14 GMT -5
[quote author=seenvic board=general thread=1283 post=7792 time=1247493579[/quote]
So lets tell the folks who do the work they are doing it wrong.
And lets start by telling them something they already know.
Brilliant! [/quote]
First please don't put negative words into my mouth about anyone who does any work on any of the trails. I appreciate everyone who works on the trail no matter how little or how much work they do.
I did 10 hours of work on my own last year. Does that make me one of those takers?
The only people I'm telling they did it wrong are those who put wooden pallets full of nails on Skinny in the first place.
They were supposed to be temporary. That was over a few years ago.
It shouldn't be like this.
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Post by seenvic on Jul 13, 2009 13:54:49 GMT -5
Ted,
I agree on the pallets. They should be gone. Because I can go move them as readily as the next guy and because everyone involved knows they should go, I don't come on here and tell the people who put them there they were wrong to do so.
I have prefabbed some treated wood replacements that could be easily put in place of the pallets. It just got hot n dry before I organized the day to get it done.
I agree it shouldn't be like this. Whatever that means.
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Post by brianW on Jul 13, 2009 14:24:23 GMT -5
What riding? I thought we only "pretended" being mt bikers. They are actual people that ride bikes in the wood no less? This must be some sort of joke. That sounds way to dangerous.
I request a moderator to look into this post.
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Post by ted on Jul 13, 2009 14:42:58 GMT -5
And that's why I'm on here saying the pallets should not be there. They shouldn't have been there in the first place.
Show me where it says that's proper trail building and I'll keep quiet.
I'm not at all reluctant to tell someone if something they did was wrong.
Isn't that what started this topic? Someone riding the trails the wrong way?
Don't discount me for highlighting (again) some shoddy work that has yet to be corrected.
FATS is being featured as what the future of mountain bike trail construction is all about. Does that include pallets?
If I shouldn't discuss this on the forum, where can I discuss it at. I feel more people have an opportunity to discuss this topic. However, I think most people are scared to voice their opinion for fear of being ridiculed and made to feel they are wrong to speak up.
Don't hate. Remember we're friends. If you can't tell your friends how you feel, who can you tell?
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Post by seenvic on Jul 13, 2009 15:22:27 GMT -5
And that's why I'm on here saying the pallets should not be there. They shouldn't have been there in the first place. Show me where it says that's proper trail building and I'll keep quiet. I'm not at all reluctant to tell someone if something they did was wrong. Isn't that what started this topic? Someone riding the trails the wrong way? Don't discount me for highlighting (again) some shoddy work that has yet to be corrected. FATS is being featured as what the future of mountain bike trail construction is all about. Does that include pallets? If I shouldn't discuss this on the forum, where can I discuss it at. I feel more people have an opportunity to discuss this topic. However, I think most people are scared to voice their opinion for fear of being ridiculed and made to feel they are wrong to speak up. Don't hate. Remember we're friends. If you can't tell your friends how you feel, who can you tell? Concerning the pallets.....Who are you telling this to that doesn't already know it? The folks with the pallets were at least trying to do the right thing. The folks riding around the bricks.......are trying to do the right thing? You lost me equating the action of putting pallets over mudholes because that seemed like a good idea, and those riding around armored areas because that seemed like a good idea. Discussing the pallets on this forum is fine. But how did a thread about riding around armoring and widening the trail become a thread about the proper use of pallets on a trail? (there are no proper uses of pallets on a trail) And I'm the hater?  |
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Post by txr on Jul 13, 2009 15:24:47 GMT -5
OK forgive me for how this may sound. But I believe this post was started a little tongue in cheek as to riding around those "obstacles". Who am I anyways but some people do come on here who are not SORBA members (I know I know..I am not) that may not understand what those bricks, rocks and yes even those ill placed pallets are and why they are there in the first place. Some may think they are there due to the trail eroding etc. They may NOT understand that they are intended to be used as a safe place to ride to save the trail bed. Just saying that some people may take this thread in the wrong vain. Not trying to start any problems, but just an observation of a sort of newbie to this forum. Feel free to disagree with me. I wont take it personally
Tom
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Post by seenvic on Jul 13, 2009 15:36:17 GMT -5
Tom,
So you are saying that it is reasonable to think someone carried a bunch of heavy bricks/concrete out into the woods, put them into this muddy spot....for me to ride next to?
I could see someone doing just that, who doesn't think, but just rides. I can see doing this in July. Or any other time of the year in which the ground next to the bricks is as firm as the bricks.
I am amazed to see 4" deep tire ruts in mud right next to a pefectly placed set of bricks that one won't sink into. But I see them each season at FATS. I saw them this winter at Brown County in Indiana as well. So, it isn't a local condition. It is widespread.
Call me crazy, but if one stops to think about why the bricks are out there, it is crazy to actually think the armor is to ride next to.
Our job is to get people to think.
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Post by txr on Jul 13, 2009 15:44:47 GMT -5
Tom, So you are saying that it is reasonable to think someone carried a bunch of heavy bricks/concrete out into the woods, put them into this muddy spot....for me to ride next to? I could see someone doing just that, who doesn't think, but just rides. I can see doing this in July. Or any other time of the year in which the ground next to the bricks is as firm as the bricks. I am amazed to see 4" deep tire ruts in mud right next to a pefectly placed set of bricks that one won't sink into. But I see them each season at FATS. I saw them this winter at Brown County in Indiana as well. So, it isn't a local condition. It is widespread. Call me crazy, but if one stops to think about why the bricks are out there, it is crazy to actually think the armor is to ride next to. Our job is to get people to think. I agree that informing is the goal. I try to do that with everyone I talk to on the trail or elsewhere when talk comes to riding trails. I agree with you in every aspect. I can only speak about myself and say I ride the bricks, wood skinnies, rocks and even the pallets whether it is wet or not. I may reconsider the pallets in dry conditions now knowing that there are nails sticking out. Guess that makes sense eh lol. Anyways, like I said informing is the key and I was just concerned that some folks may read this thread in a different way....especially the thread starter. No offense intended and none taken on your response. Tom |
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Post by Mark Y on Jul 13, 2009 15:58:19 GMT -5
I thought the topic starter's "tongue in cheek" was evident, but I guess people unaware of the hard work put in to armor the trails might not understand it.
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Post by seenvic on Jul 13, 2009 16:03:18 GMT -5
Tongue in cheek quite evident to me.
I know Russell well, but would have understood it regardless.
Perhaps an educational sign near the trailhead about riding on, not around the armoring.
And, someone please go remove those pallets.
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Post by Angela on Jul 13, 2009 17:05:40 GMT -5
And again sarcasm/tongue in cheek/etc doesn't always set as well in the written word and folks may or may not know who the people vollying back and forth are or what their relationship is.........this forum is read by a wide variety of folks and many are new to this sport and just trying to figure things out. What to do, where to ride, who to talk to .........it should be a friendly message with a positive tone in my opinion. As far as the armoring (and I've done my share) at times the ground has just been so hard trying to get the armoring set well has been difficult at best. If the armoring is viewed as an obstacle - a rider approaching might opt to go around it at the last minute particularly if they are tired. A harsh line should be reserved for the most extreme cases not for folks who are just trying to learn what to do, ride their bikes, and meet other bikers. No one needs to feel like they are getting attacked because of a simple statement or comment they make. Folks should be able to expect a civil response to a comment or statement they make even if everyone doesn't agree with that statement. This forum should be fun and informative and the members of SORBA-CSRA should be friendly and welcoming and willing to share what they know respectfully - it doesn't always come across that way on this forum and to be honest I find that increasingly disturbing.  |
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Post by txr on Jul 13, 2009 18:16:54 GMT -5
And again sarcasm/tongue in cheek/etc doesn't always set as well in the written word and folks may or may not know who the people vollying back and forth are or what their relationship is.........this forum is read by a wide variety of folks and many are new to this sport and just trying to figure things out. What to do, where to ride, who to talk to .........it should be a friendly message with a positive tone in my opinion. As far as the armoring (and I've done my share) at times the ground has just been so hard trying to get the armoring set well has been difficult at best. If the armoring is viewed as an obstacle - a rider approaching might opt to go around it at the last minute particularly if they are tired. A harsh line should be reserved for the most extreme cases not for folks who are just trying to learn what to do, ride their bikes, and meet other bikers. No one needs to feel like they are getting attacked because of a simple statement or comment they make. Folks should be able to expect a civil response to a comment or statement they make even if everyone doesn't agree with that statement. This forum should be fun and informative and the members of SORBA-CSRA should be friendly and welcoming and willing to share what they know respectfully - it doesn't always come across that way on this forum and to be honest I find that increasingly disturbing. Angela, you have stated what I was trying to say in a much better way than I did  Like you have stated, many folks read this forum and not all understand the banter. Again, I have not tried to start anything, just wanted to state what you have said above. New riders will be joining this sport and may turn here to find information. Anyway , just my opinion. And I DO appreciate all that give of their time to maintain the trails. Tom |
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Post by Angela on Jul 13, 2009 19:04:56 GMT -5
It just upsets me Tom because I have known all these guys for such a long time and I love them to pieces. Mountain bikers are among the most generous, helpful, friendly bunch of folks I've ever had the pleasure of knowing and I have worked and ridden beside all these guys for a lot of years and fed them dozens of cookies at dozens of work parties they really are the best so I want all the other folks to know that not only do we have miles and miles of wonderful trails to ride but we have some truly terrific folks in this area. I remember we were out at Turkey Creek one day for a ride and a person in our group had managed to leave their front tire behind. Another rider who did not know any of us handed over his front tire (he was just finishing riding) and his business card. I won't fill this up with all the acts of kindness, of pure unselfish help (along the trail helping someone with a mechanical, waiting with an injured rider, coming out to help at an emergency trail repair party at the last minute, showing beginning riders the ropes or helping folks find a trail to ride) I've personally witnessed.......I'm sure everyone gets the point. I want the other riders and those new to riding to think - hey I'd like to be a part of that - the comraderie, the fun, the sense of purpose...........it's a good thing. Every week I see our members in the parking lot talking to folks there and it is a great thing. I just feel like if you can't influence folks in a positive way something is wrong. A lot of education still needs to be done...........I see folks without their helmets every day out riding and I cringe since I've seen many of the accidents............I see folks doing things on the trail that are detrimental and normally it is lack of understanding not malicious intent.........I've seen folks heading out onto the trail 10 minutes before night falls without night lights.........people need to know why we are being protective and what is at stake. No one wants to be made a fool of or treated as if they are stupid. We've all made plenty of mistakes along the way and I for one feel glad those teaching me were kind...........I actually tried to get my husband who is an engineer to put a kick-stand on my mountain bike when I first received it  .................The forum is a great place for exchanging ideas but sometimes a private message might be more appropriate rather than get everyone riled up. |
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Post by imnav8r on Jul 13, 2009 19:07:07 GMT -5
John Pilcher, Julie Gambill, and I went out to FATS early this evening and removed all of the pallets from the Skinny Loop power line connector. John used a pulaski to try to soften up the dirt edges where the pallets had been but it will take a few wheels riding through there to smooth it all out. No snakes...just a few wasps nests! A more permanant solution to the trail bed will be made in the near future. We also attempted to remove the other large pallet on Upper Skinny near where the blue t-shirt is hanging in the tree. That one is a beast, but still surprisingly in good shape. I believe it is made of oak and hence the extra weight. We put it back in its place and then placed some deterrent logs along the sides of that one to try to keep riders on the pallet as they make their way along the trail. If you see JP and Julie, please show your appreciation and support for their rapid response in helping to remove the problem area. Thanks also to Bill Victor, and Russell Hale for providing accurate directions to get to the pallets by vehicle & foot! Be safe! |
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Like you have stated, many folks read this forum and not all understand the banter. Again, I have not tried to start anything, just wanted to state what you have said above. New riders will be joining this sport and may turn here to find information. Anyway , just my opinion. And I DO appreciate all that give of their time to maintain the trails. 
.................The forum is a great place for exchanging ideas but sometimes a private message might be more appropriate rather than get everyone riled up. 