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Post by brando on Aug 23, 2013 19:56:15 GMT -5
I stated my opinion about the USFS. My opinion comes from personal experience in seeing how the Service manages its land. My point is that the less the USFS has to think about something the better off everyone is. They don't have the desire or manpower to go locking and unlocking gates or checking trail conditions. I feel They'd rather slap a closed notice on gate rather than work through an issue and come up with a specific management plan. In your meeting, tell em SORBA-CSRA has everything handled. That your using the groups extensive knowledge of trail management experience to protect the resource while also allowing the public access to recreational opportunities. Just my opinion.
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Post by oddcouple on Aug 23, 2013 22:07:50 GMT -5
Keeping a few mud riders off the trails by getting the Forest service involved may keep everybody off permanently. All the USFS cares to manage is pine trees. Recreation is a secondary headache to them that gets in the way of their logging contracts. +1
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Post by seenvic on Aug 24, 2013 8:29:13 GMT -5
I stated my opinion about the USFS. My opinion comes from personal experience in seeing how the Service manages its land. Growing up I wanted to work for the Service. Job shadowing and working temp jobs with them showed me how under-staffed and under-paid the people who work for them are. I also came to see how bureaucratic their management plans are. Google "Southern Four Wheel Drive et al. v USFS" concerning closure of the Upper Tellico OHV. Tellico was arguably the most prominent off highway vehicle area east of the Mississippi. The Forest Service didn't have to lift a finger to keep the trails open and managed. Almost all the upkeep came from volunteers from the Southern Four Wheel Drive Association and various other groups. Nobody thought it could be closed but the USFS under pressure from Trout Unlimited and others closed the trails a few years ago. They then contracted out a million doller+ contract to a company to obliterate the trails. And finally ,in typical USFS fashion, proceeded to clear cut the entire are and silt up all the creeks that supposedly were in need of protection from the jeep trails. Another example that has influenced my opinion towards the Forest service concerns the Parson's Mtn atv trails in Abbeville county. They are also managed by the Long Cane Ranger district. Several years ago gates were put up to keep dirtbikes and atv's off the trails during times of wet trail conditions. There were times in the summer when the trails were dry and dusty and we'd show up to ride only to have the gates locked. Maybe the Forest guy just didn't get around to it that day or forgot, or didn't care to drive down there and do it. I just know that this happened numerous times to myself and people I know. I've rambled too long. My point is that the less the USFS has to think about something the better off everyone is. They don't have the desire or manpower to go locking and unlocking gates or checking trail conditions. I feel They'd rather slap a closed notice on gate rather than work through an issue and come up with a specific management plan. In your meeting, tell em SORBA-CSRA has everything handled. That your using the groups extensive knowledge of trail management experience to protect the resource while also allowing the public access to recreational opportunities. Just my opinion. Apples and oranges. Do you see any motorized trails being built on federal property? No. Do you see any non motorized trails being built on federal property? yes. They are managed differently at all levels. On the Parsons Mtn deal, that sucks. But they have a call before you haul line to see if the trails are open. The first time it was dry and dusty - and you showed up and it was closed.....that sucks. But at point you should have known to call the number. FATS can't be closed for 25 years from at least 2003. It was built with RTP $$$ and the USFS signed on saying it couldn't be closed for 25 years. USFS will work with SORBACSRA to manage it. That part you have right.
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Post by dsquaredmsquared on Aug 26, 2013 8:48:32 GMT -5
FATS is open.
We received word from the Long Cane Ranger District that the Forks Area Trail System (FATS) is now open. Enjoy.
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Post by dsquaredmsquared on Sept 5, 2013 9:49:33 GMT -5
FATS and hunting season.
We had a meeting with the USFS earlier this week and were informed that FATS will NOT be closed in October (during the first two weeks of hunting season) like it has been in recent years.
During hunting season, and particularly during the first two weeks, trail users should consider not riding/running trails early in the morning (sunrise) or late in the evening (sunset), avoid wearing white clothing, and definitely be sure that you are visible to hunters by wearing a blaze orange vest while out on the trails. These common sense safety suggestions are not only relevant to FATS, but also apply to Bartram and other trails in the CSRA where hunting occurs in the same forest, park, or adjacent tracts of land.
Thank you for your support.
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Post by brianW on Sept 5, 2013 19:35:06 GMT -5
When does the season begin?
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Post by brando on Sept 5, 2013 21:55:59 GMT -5
For Carolina: Deer rifle season already in on Aiken county and south towards the coast. For Edgefield and Mccormick counties north:
Archery begins sept 16 Muzzleloader: Oct 1 Rifle: Oct 11 Hunting not allowed on public lands on sunday. Not sure about Ga.
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Post by Angela on Sept 10, 2013 6:37:58 GMT -5
Not sure when hunting season starts in Georgia but they hunt 7 days a week so be sure and wear your orange vest and try to avoid those most active hunting times of the day!
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Post by dsquaredmsquared on Oct 1, 2013 12:53:48 GMT -5
FATS is officially closed during the government shutdown.
Forks Area Trail System is considered a developed recreation area (toilets, water), so it is officially closed during the government shutdown. Since this is an official closure, you can be ticketed and/or fined if caught trespassing.
Horn Creek Trail is closed too. Undeveloped trails like Modoc, Wine, and Turkey will remain open during the shutdown. Don't risk a ticket by poaching FATS. We'll update with new information as it comes our way.
Thank you for your support.
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Post by tzeaser on Oct 4, 2013 6:54:52 GMT -5
Good news is that FS661 was re-graded this week. Glad someone is working.
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Post by deano on Oct 4, 2013 11:38:11 GMT -5
FATS can't be closed for 25 years from at least 2003. It was built with RTP $$$ and the USFS signed on saying it couldn't be closed for 25 years. Read more: sorbacsra.proboards.com/thread/3421?page=13#ixzz2glv294cHhhhhmmmm.... Anyways, hopefully turkey and wine get some much need wheels during this closure.
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Post by brando on Oct 4, 2013 11:46:57 GMT -5
I'd already thought about how this is the second time this year it's been closed.... Are all recreational activities closed? Just throw an orange vest on and say your scouting for deer.
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Post by kconner on Oct 4, 2013 13:42:42 GMT -5
FATS can't be closed for 25 years from at least 2003. It was built with RTP $$$ and the USFS signed on saying it couldn't be closed for 25 years. Read more: sorbacsra.proboards.com/thread/3421?page=13#ixzz2glv294cHhhhhmmmm.... Anyways, hopefully turkey and wine get some much need wheels during this closure. As I understand it, FATS can't be closed PERMANENTLY until at least 2028. I see this as being different from TEMPORARY closures. For example, earlier this year FATS was closed temporarily due to adverse weather conditions, and FATS should have been closed more than once this spring/summer IMHO. This time FATS was closed because of a bunch of bickering politicians, which sucks, but doesn't mean it's being closed permanently. FATS has opened up after all other temporary closures, and I feel confident that it will open back up once the politicians grow up (IF they grow up). That's why it's a TEMPORARY closure. Anyways, how is a closure at FATS always a bad thing? While FATS is close to home for me and is where I do a large chunk of my riding just because of convenience, I look at FATS closures as just another excuse to ride some of our other trails, most of which are a straight up awesome ride. I'd stay off of FATS during the closure. It looks bad for mountain bikers as a whole, and besides, who wants to deal with a ticket/fine when there's great trails just up the road?
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Post by dsquaredmsquared on Oct 4, 2013 14:21:28 GMT -5
FATS can't be closed for 25 years from at least 2003. It was built with RTP $$$ and the USFS signed on saying it couldn't be closed for 25 years. Read more: sorbacsra.proboards.com/thread/3421?page=13#ixzz2glv294cHhhhhmmmm.... Anyways, hopefully turkey and wine get some much need wheels during this closure. Unless you are trolling, this is hardly a lesson in semantics; operational closure versus eliminating the trail closure.
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Post by brianW on Oct 4, 2013 19:53:14 GMT -5
the closure is nothing to save money (a locked bathroom would do that) but to cause as much headache to the users of the trail and in a grander scale the American population. Just like not allowing volunteers to maintain trails during this time. If it was about "non-essential" government employees then why isn't barrack or Michele driving the kids to school or cooking their meals? Two weeks ago we ha enough money to bomb Syria but now not enough to clean a bathroom?......and yes i have contacted my Representative and Senator.
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Post by deano on Oct 4, 2013 19:58:09 GMT -5
Trolling? No just making a general statement. And I think the gov will/can do anything they want contract or not. So I don't put a lot of faith in that, but anyways, I don't wanna derail this thread anymore. I understand what Kconner is saying. I hate to see it closed but also understand sometimes its good for the preservation of a trail that gets this much traffic. Like I said earlier, hopefully this will give the less traveled trails some attention.
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Post by bigtime on Oct 9, 2013 8:20:33 GMT -5
So the trail is "closed" and most of the rangers are furloughed. So who is there to catch you riding the trail?
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Post by dsquaredmsquared on Oct 9, 2013 10:59:44 GMT -5
So the trail is "closed" and most of the rangers are furloughed. So who is there to catch you riding the trail? Yes, most rangers are furloughed. However, USFS law enforcement is not furloughed. We've heard that people have been poaching. Don't know if or when USFS law enforcement checks FATS. However, the USFS has posted the trailhead as officially closed, so ignorance of the closure is not an excuse if you get caught. YMMV.
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Post by brando on Oct 9, 2013 20:53:34 GMT -5
"Poaching"? Really? On OUR own land? Don't use the parking areas. Just park on the side of the road somewhere like the hunters do. The land is not closed just the "Facilities". I think SC Department of Natural Resources handles the law enforcement. At least I've never seen a USFS law officer around here. I might use the trails to do some "wildlife viewing" there tomorrow. ;-)
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Post by nitro on Oct 10, 2013 7:25:22 GMT -5
"Poaching"? Really? On OUR own land? Don't use the parking areas. Just park on the side of the road somewhere like the hunters do. The land is not closed just the "Facilities". I think SC Department of Natural Resources handles the law enforcement. At least I've never seen a USFS law officer around here. I might use the trails to do some "wildlife viewing" there tomorrow. ;-) Is hunting still allowed at FATS???
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