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Post by dgaddis1 on Sept 28, 2010 7:09:14 GMT -5
Now that the SMC is behind us, we've already started thinking about plans for our big event next year. Lots of ideas have been thrown around.
-Another SMC
-A 6/12hr race
-Something on Bartram/Keg/Mistletoe route
-Something else in the Modoc/Turkey/Wine area
They all have pluses and minuses.
What would YOU like us to do? What would you like to race in? What would you like to volunteer at?
Things to consider:
-Audience - something for a local average joe mtn biker, or something for hardcore racer types?
-Time of year - has a lot to do with trail maintenance and rain
-Trail Maintenance - how much do we need to do? Is it a good thing?
-Rain - some routes have alternative routes to keep from damaging trails, some don't, then we'd need an alternate date.
-Distance options
-Difficulty
-Man power - some events take more volunteers to put on than others
Lets hear everyone's thoughts.
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Post by ted on Sept 28, 2010 7:51:49 GMT -5
How about something at LCHT?
How about bringing the time trials back to FATS?
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Post by dgaddis1 on Sept 28, 2010 8:07:42 GMT -5
How about something at LCHT? How about bringing the time trials back to FATS? The Greenwood guys have mentioned wanting to do an event at LCHT to purchase a DR to keep up there. TT at FATS will most likely happen next year sometime. Participant number will be limited so we don't need a permit (less than 75 racers), no entry fee and you MUST be an IMBA-SORBA member, then we don't need to purchase insurance. |
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Post by Mark Y on Sept 28, 2010 9:01:31 GMT -5
You may run short of volunteers if you have an event "average Joe" can participate in.  The Bartram/Mistletoe idea is interesting. You could segment that one easy enough to have a short route/long route, and it is all trail. Starting from West Dam though, you would probably need to stage the starts in smaller groups because of bottleneck at the trailhead. Plenty of access too for SAGS and rescue. |
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Post by dgaddis1 on Sept 28, 2010 9:06:07 GMT -5
You may run short of volunteers if you have an event "average Joe" can participate in. The Bartram/Mistletoe idea is interesting. You could segment that one easy enough to have a short route/long route, and it is all trail. Starting from West Dam though, you would probably need to stage the starts in smaller groups because of bottleneck at the trailhead. Plenty of access too for SAGS and rescue. One problem with Bartram/Keg/Mistletoe actually is there isn't a good and easy way to have shorter distances without having head on traffic, and that's something we want to avoid. |
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Post by Mark Y on Sept 28, 2010 9:30:31 GMT -5
My thoughts on that is that you start the long distance people first. By the time they are headed back the majority, if not all of the short distance people should be turned around and headed back. I don't remember the distances, but perhaps the short route could be West Dam to the clearing before you go back into singletrack between Wildwood and Washington Rd; including the loop at Lake Springs. Surely people could get to that point before the long distance folks get back that far? That would also be a nice place to set up a SAG. You understand the distances and average speeds better than I do, so do the arithmetic for someone averaging 7mph vs 12, or whatever speeds you hotrods ride at through Keg and Mistletoe. Is there any way to get out of Mistletoe and back to the beginning of Bartram/Wash Rd without going back through Keg? If so, that would eliminate the slower long distance riders from going head on with the faster long distance folks on the return trip.
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Post by dgaddis1 on Sept 28, 2010 9:44:01 GMT -5
My thoughts on that is that you start the long distance people first. By the time they are headed back the majority, if not all of the short distance people should be turned around and headed back. I don't remember the distances, but perhaps the short route could be West Dam to the clearing before you go back into singletrack between Wildwood and Washington Rd; including the loop at Lake Springs. Surely people could get to that point before the long distance folks get back that far? That would also be a nice place to set up a SAG. You understand the distances and average speeds better than I do, so do the arithmetic for someone averaging 7mph vs 12, or whatever speeds you hotrods ride at through Keg and Mistletoe. Is there any way to get out of Mistletoe and back to the beginning of Bartram/Wash Rd without going back through Keg? If so, that would eliminate the slower long distance riders from going head on with the faster long distance folks on the return trip. I see a race there with two options: Epic - full bartram/keg/mistletoe 50 mile - bartram and keg With those there would be very little, if any, two way traffic. Epic riders go off first, followed by the 50 milers shortly after. By the time the first person finishes Keg and gets back on Bartram everyone else should be off Bartram and somewhere on the Keg loop. But that 'short distance' is still a huge ride, 50 miles of singletrack. If you did a shorter, Bartram only option, you're gonna have two way traffic. Unless we shuttle people to Keg, and let them ride Keg and Bartram back to West Dam. This route would also need 3 SAG stops, but they'd all be active at the same time. That's a lot of volunteers. |
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Post by Ted S. on Sept 28, 2010 10:15:07 GMT -5
Liking the idea of the Thurmond EPIC vs 50 mile distance.
is there a legal way to cut out of the back of keg and get over to Mistletoe?
Are 'we' thinking of doing 2 events next year/ the SMC(may need a catchier name) and another event.
One in the Spring one in the fall?or even a summer event a lot of people are attracted to the PAIN of big climbs, long distances, and in our case HEAT. Give the event a catchy name. If its out along Bartram everyone can be advised to jump in the lake if they can't take it.
If we want to attract the average Joe as well the racers is it logistically possible to offer a third distance one way only point to point. west Dam to WW? and set up a shuttle or just pedal back on the rd.
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Post by Mark Y on Sept 28, 2010 10:48:47 GMT -5
My thoughts on that is that you start the long distance people first. By the time they are headed back the majority, if not all of the short distance people should be turned around and headed back. I don't remember the distances, but perhaps the short route could be West Dam to the clearing before you go back into singletrack between Wildwood and Washington Rd; including the loop at Lake Springs. Surely people could get to that point before the long distance folks get back that far? That would also be a nice place to set up a SAG. You understand the distances and average speeds better than I do, so do the arithmetic for someone averaging 7mph vs 12, or whatever speeds you hotrods ride at through Keg and Mistletoe. Is there any way to get out of Mistletoe and back to the beginning of Bartram/Wash Rd without going back through Keg? If so, that would eliminate the slower long distance riders from going head on with the faster long distance folks on the return trip. I see a race there with two options: Epic - full bartram/keg/mistletoe 50 mile - bartram and keg With those there would be very little, if any, two way traffic. Epic riders go off first, followed by the 50 milers shortly after. By the time the first person finishes Keg and gets back on Bartram everyone else should be off Bartram and somewhere on the Keg loop. But that 'short distance' is still a huge ride, 50 miles of singletrack. If you did a shorter, Bartram only option, you're gonna have two way traffic. Unless we shuttle people to Keg, and let them ride Keg and Bartram back to West Dam. This route would also need 3 SAG stops, but they'd all be active at the same time. That's a lot of volunteers. SAG stops really don't require that many people. Two/per is enough to get by provided the provisioning is properly set up. You can use more on the set up, but after that there is only so much hands on needed. SAG 1 probably is the busiest with riders still coming in close together, but after that they begin to get some separation. One thing we do need to do differently is have more table space so we can spread out the SAG bags. Working from the bin is impractical for the riders to sort through and there is no way the SAG staff can dig through it for a particular number either. A 50 miler would still eliminate Joe; I imagine most people in condition to tackle 50 would be able to do the epic. 30 would be more in line with attracting the weekend warriors. One way Bartram/Keg would come close to that? It isn't a bad road ride back around to West Dam from there, but a shuttle would work too. I'm sure there are enough trailers floating around that several bikes at the time could be transported. Again, the big challenge with that will be keeping enough volunteers as I'm sure many who volunteered the past two years for the SMC would probably tackle the shorter distance. Even if you just roundtripped West Dam to Wildwood, I don't think that group would be large enough to pose a significant problem with two way traffic. Suppose there are 20 people strung out over that route, the worst that can happen is you have 10 two way meetings. that likelihood is diminished some if you form some kind of loop at Wildwood, which would be easy to do. One last thought. If you do it around the lake, lets try to do it when it isn't prime lake time. Too much traffic on the roads around there. The Bartram/ Keg crossing and the North/West Keg trailhead back across the bridge to Bartram (if part of the route) can be sketchy on a slow day. |
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Post by seenvic on Sept 28, 2010 11:21:26 GMT -5
We need tarps on the ground to spread out the sag bags.
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Post by Mark Y on Sept 28, 2010 11:34:48 GMT -5
Unless there is plenty of shade, those things would be in the sun. With the table and people there is not enough room under the tent to spread a tarp. It is definitely a problem looking for a solution.
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Post by dsquaredmsquared on Sept 28, 2010 11:37:15 GMT -5
Bigger garbage box(es) or container(s) for each SAG.
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Post by brianW on Sept 28, 2010 11:41:35 GMT -5
Bartram/Keg/Mistletoe start at Lake Springs (and end) I personally feel it is better than West Dam for a facility. This also gives the ability to spread out racers more with a small road section in the park before "bottlenecking" on single track.
3 options
a. Bartram only (beginner)
b. Bartram/Keg (intermediate)
c. all three (expert)
2 Sags Washington road (hit twice by some) and Mistletoe.
Only area w/ two way traffic would be Bartram, and excess trails/roads from Mistletoe to Keg.
Keg and Bartram are usally in good shape. Mistletoe is the question. The spring would also reduce the amount of mowing needed.
Time trails at FATS would be a nice summer event.
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Post by dsquaredmsquared on Sept 28, 2010 11:45:29 GMT -5
JP has a camera full of pictures (at least the front of the pack during the parade out of the park and a few of the riders passing the truck during the start).
JP: Let me know if you need help getting them off the camera and/or posted.
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Post by bikerpanda on Sept 28, 2010 12:05:03 GMT -5
I would more likely sign up for a 30 mile race then a 50 mile race. I consider myself a weekend warrior. Im certianly no where near the caliber of rider the SMC beasts were.
A bigger canopy for shade with a tarp is a great idea. Problem is still space though.
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Post by Angela on Sept 28, 2010 19:39:00 GMT -5
Just my two cents, the volunteers who volunteer at these events do so out of a desire to help SORBA with the event not because they cannot ride in the event. I won't speak for other volunteers but if I honestly thought that an event was structured specifically to exclude my participation so I would work the event as a volunteer I guarantee you I would not be volunteering. Most of the volunteers at these events have participated in events such as the Baker's Dozen, Sumter Metric Century, etc. we just know that some of us can ride and some of us have to step up and support the event. I think the more people you can include by having events they can participate in the better we are. There are far more Average Joe's out there than there are folks who have the time to train for a 50 mile mountain bike event so let's do something that can maximize participation and celebrate the great variety of riders we have in our chapter (which is why we first started doing events in the first place).  I think we can offer enough options safely to encompass the majority of folks who want to participate and I think we will always have the great volunteers who manage to find the time to step up (some do both, participate and volunteer)! |
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Post by lee79 on Sept 28, 2010 21:02:58 GMT -5
The number of riders was half as many as 2009. Why? Conflicting events? Heat?
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Post by Mark Y on Sept 28, 2010 21:39:33 GMT -5
Angela, I did not mean to imply that a race was structured to exclude anyone or that people volunteered simply because they weren't up to 70 miles. The fact is though, that not many who did volunteer had either the wherewithall to train or the ability even if they did. I know fall into that category. So, if I can't/won't compete, I might as well help. I know that I would probably give it a whirl if the training goal was attainable, as would Jeff who stated so above. I know others who would as well; and that would definitely trim down the volunteer numbers.
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Post by dparrott on Sept 28, 2010 21:57:29 GMT -5
I talked to Paul about the start/end venue and we came up with the pavillion below the Dam - same place as the spring "Dam Ride" put on by Chain Reaction. That event is attracting ~300 or so riders. I noticed in this past Dam Ride where the below dam start was used for the first time, that the initial steep hill created a pretty good separation of riders. In the past, with starts up at or near Rt 221, I was able to keep up with the lead peloton for the first 15 miles - couldn't do that this year with the big hill.
For the SAG bag issue - pick spots where there's plenty of shade.
Lollipop routes, i.e. BT/Keg and BT/Keg/Mistletoe (let's call it Rock Dam Trail - there are a number of named trails in Mistletoe S.P.) would create separation to pretty much eliminate 2 way traffic. Problem would be a BT only route that would fold back on itself.
I believe that issues could be worked out to create a desirable event that would attract a broader cross section of participation.
Volunteers: Think outside the box! Don't limit volunteers to just SORBA folks. The Augusta Triathlon had about 800 volunteers. How many of those do you think were tri-athletes? With all the press that SORBA has mustered in the past few years, I bet we could greatly expand that base.
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Post by Angela on Sept 28, 2010 22:35:41 GMT -5
Understand what you are saying Mark but to be honest depending on the event it isn't always either or - for the years we did the Baker's Dozen, I handled the food for the riders and the volunteers and for 3 of those years I raced as well and I am not the only volunteer who has done double duty just takes a little more planning and organization. Some of the volunteers at this year's SMC annually do Century rides (road) and have done 50 mile singletrack rides as well so sometimes it is simply a matter of choice - ride the event, volunteer for the event or both. |
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I think we can offer enough options safely to encompass the majority of folks who want to participate and I think we will always have the great volunteers who manage to find the time to step up (some do both, participate and volunteer)!